[quote="Ronanan"]traversées courte sur voltes adverses?




by the way, couldn't you say "crossing" for "traversée", rather than "cross movement" ? It's the first word that came into my mind when I wanted t translate "traversée" in English, but then again, I'm French, so ...
And ow do you translate "garde" in English


in French traversée is formed from the past participle of traverser. to follow the same formation in English, the past participle of "to cross/traverser" would be "crossed" not CROSSING. Crossing is the present participle, or the equivalent of "traversant" in French.

Garde in English is "guard"
we say EN GARDE to mean "put up your guard" i.e. get in position.

Claude Rose helped me translate some things for Bertrand Dubreuil. I think the development of a lexicon for Canne in English is something that should be developed by an international committee of French/Canadian/British/American bi-lingual speakers and writers.

In French, we use the past participle because it is the only way to make a substantive from an action verb(in this case a movement).
Whereas in English, I think, the best way to form a noun out of an action verb is to use the present participle. I may be totally wrong and it is not a really serious matter, but I find it helpful to talk about these matters, for my own personnal edification, I mean.
I agree with you on the idea of a lexicon (the more people are involved, the better) : la canne de combat uses so much technical words and expressions that trying to explain them can be long and tedious, whereas translating them can help the understanding.
On the other hand, it IS a French sport, and, exactly like the japanese martial arts, we should perhaps keep the french expressions in official competitions.
which makes the idea of an offical lexicon a tricky debate.

Perhaps you are right about noun formation from verbs. but the further problem for a translator is that the languages do not use the formations in an equivalent fashion. traversée when explained in English cannot be called a crossing. it would have to be labeled a "crossing movement" or something along that nature using a noun adjective pair.

for the lexicon i agree, along the lines of ballet where the terms remained French. still there is the need to explain in English what is meant for the people who don't speak french.

Yes, you are right about the difference of noun formations. It would probably be called "crossing movement". I was just wondering about the different possibilities we would have to name "traversée" in English. Cross movement is plain enough, but to me it conveys the idea of the shape of a cross. But I am just hair splitting.
There is also the problem of oral understanding : when a referee says something, say "non-respect du principe parade/esquive/riposte" in a fight, as it is a rather long phrase, an English speaker might not understand exactly what he said (or might not have heard). Beyond the issue of the basic skill of understanding, it sets the problem of speaking with enough clarity to be understood by the non-french speaking "tireurs".
Hence the gesture system which erases this barrier, but is still in development, if I am not mistaken.
However, if it is developped and approved, we will end up like in Basketball where the referee, when he stops the game, does not always speaks the faults, but only "gestures" them.
I think in that case, there would be no use for the french words and phrases anymore, which would be convenient for them, but a shame as well.

I 'm not sure, the french realy enjoye talking

Indeed.
There are more french-speaking people speaking english on this english-speaking forum than english-speaking people speaking french on any french-speaking forum.
voilà.

for traversé one could say "a movement traversing the opponent's stance" or some such, if you don't like the idea of cross.

but for me as a native Englsih speaker, "cross" doesn't have the unique connotation of the "cross".

whatever. hand gestures would be good. but still the need to have explanations in multiple languages behind the gestures will exist.

Oh well ...
Like I said, this was just hair splitting ...
"cross movement" works fine and not using cross would force us to use longer expressions to name it.
"a movement traversing the opponent's stance" is a good explanation of "une traversée". I haven't even looked at the technical definition in french, but to me, it explains pretty well what it is. People can find out when to use a "traversée" by themselves, can't they ?

cross stance move?

Short unidirectionnal but rotating move crossing an opponent's stance ?
I don't know ...


Mmmmh. I'm not sure of my spelling in "unidirectionnal". I'm not even sure it exists.

if you to karate, all the move are in japanese, if you do kung foo their all in chinese. If you watch baseball, all the call will be in english, so Ithink the terme for the canne should stay in french (with english explaination if needed)

makes sense to keep the french terms but there is still the need to explain, and that is the "translator's turn" which creates the problems. Even watching someone execute the moves one can fail to grasp their complexity. Or having grasped the concept intellectually one can still fail miserably in their execution!